City Council - Public Works and Natural Resources Committee

[Music] all right let's go ahead and begin here this is the February 26 uh 2024 meeting of the Bellingham city council we've got uh some standing committee meetings this afternoon uh first up is our Public Works and natural resources committee that it is uh chaired by council member Stone thank you very much president Hamill um good afternoon so I'm joined on the public work and natural resources committee by council members Anderson and Lila Quist um we have a couple of items before us this afternoon and before getting started I just wanted to um acknowledge that National Engineers week was this past week and so I know that we're coming up on the end of that but in thinking about it it's interesting as an attorney and looking at things about engineers I didn't realize there were so many like jokes and memes so I'm feeling some kinship as an attorney with all the engineers in the city um but just wanting to take a moment to really Express appre app ation for all of that work and really reflecting on just the complexity of all of the moving parts that you have to juggle um here in the city as well as competing um or just layered interests and priorities right to come to an end end product and make that all work so just wanting to express some appreciation to those members of our team here in the city um and so getting started this afternoon the first agenda item is agenda Bill 2421 this is a contract award for indefinite delivery indefinite quantity asphalt repair services

this is Bid number 8 b-224 the city solicited bids for an indefinite delivery indefinite quantity contract for asphalt repair services work will be performed on an as-needed basis over a maximum term of four years subject to not to exceed contract amount of 5 million the city received five bids that were publicly opened on January 25th 20 24 in Western Refinery Services of Ferndale Washington was the responsible bidder who submitted the lowest responsive bid of 1,233 1831 per year the engineer estimate was 1,386 421 per year the contract is not subject to apprenticeship utilization requirements because individual work orders are expected to be well under a million dollar um and so for this item I'm first going to turn to Public Works director Eric Johnston thank you Miss Stone appreciate the comments about the engineers uh Public Works uh there's we appreciate that sentiment so thank you for that uh so this contract uh award today is another of a series of indefinite indefinite quantity indefinite delivery cont idiq contracts that we've been bringing forward over the last couple of years uh previously this type of work for uh repairing patching uh and fixing some of our asphalt roadways has been done under a normal contract that was extended over a period of years so we have been doing this type Ty of work by contract for many many many many years going back several decades uh this is just a new Contracting model to use to to make it more efficient in terms of how we get the

work done in consistency with some other contracts uh we're recommending that we continue this again we are of course always mindful of the needs to to be mindful as stated in the agenda bill for the apprenticeship program we don't feel it's appropriate to apply that to this particular type of contract given the nature of the work that's that's varied throughout times of things we're also mindful as as you would expect or uh expect of us of the relationship between the city and our unions and the roles that each of the Unions would play and we are of the opinion this needs to continue to be contracted workout and not be brought under the city's umbrella so we are mindful of those elements as we're moving forward be happy to answer any questions you might have our recommendation as is spelled out in the agenda bill is to authorize the contract council member list yeah I I see no problem with uh awarding into lowest responsive B but I wanted to ask a question about the idiq contract is this the first time done idiq for the asphalt it is so my question is um have we are we seeing the same companies bid for The idiq Who bid previously for the non idiq contract and are these all known entities are we just in terms of the players are we getting different players or are these the same players just paid for differently yeah this is the same group of players just paid for differently wrs has been our low bidder on the last at least 10 years for this contract and they they continue to

be very aggressive going after this work thank you I guess similarly along those lines um looking at the other bids that were received noting that there were right two companies based in Bellingham that were one significantly higher and so I know we've had discussion about prior bids and one was similar to this sort of an idiq where is there any question about because of the discrepancy there question about understanding about what was to be did on those projects or is it just a difference no we we see the the Bellingham group that had the high bid we see that a lot from that company that company is based out of California that is where their headquarters is at and their bids we've had this conversation with them why are you always so high their bids are run out of California so they have guidelines on what they bid for items and they have to follow those guidelines thank you for that any questions from Council I think we're looking for a motion to award to award the contract council member Anderson move approval any further discussion okay seeing none all in favor will say I I any opposed or abstentions seeing none that passes 30 and I'll bring forward that recommendation this evening thank you very much so the next item before us this afternoon is agenda Bill 2422 this is the bicycle master plan Phase 2 engagement summary the bicycle master plan the Bellingham bicycle master plan was adopted by City Council in October of 2014 the city is in the process of updating the BMP

to ensure ongoing implementation a team of City staff consultants and the Transportation Commission developed a draft recommended Network policies and program actions for the BMP using Community feedback that was gathered during spring of 2023 in the phase 1 engagement process City staff and their consultant presented this information to the community Community during a second phase of Engagement and this process included technical review committee meetings virtual community open houses and spreading the word throughout the community encouraging people to visit the engaged Bellingham web page to review and comment on the associated story map City staff have prepared a summary of what was heard from the community during this phase two of Engagement so for this item I'll first turn to Public Works director Eric Johnston and I'm going to turn it straight over to Mr Joel fun and Natalie Monroe who we going to talk about what we've done been recently doing might I will will say that recall when we started this process with The Pedestrian master plan and the bicycle master plan we talked about doing some creative things with uh Outreach and engagement and I think we're seeing the results of that one of those results is this is taking a little longer than we expected to and that is in part in our response to the way that the feedback has come in and how we are adjusting and adapting uh the development of those documents to reflect what the community has has put out there uh and as

they're getting the slideshow put up here uh we are getting close to being done so expecting to go to the Transportation Commission in March or April for their uh recommendation of approval to the council and back to the council in April May or June for final approval of those documents so with that I'll turn it to Joel and probably straight to Natalie I think yeah so excuse me uh Joel fun assistant Public Works director and um we um Natalie and I have been working very diligently with the community here in um in November December and early Jan January and had a really good conversation with the community got a lot of feedback from a lot of different sources and um so I'm going to pass it over to Natalie to give a summary of um of what we did okay uh well thank you I am Natalie Monro I think I came up to answer answer questions once but this is my first time presenting to you all um really excited to talk to you all closer aha that's better um really excited to talk to you all about this we're really excited about the engagement that we got um on this phase and so we'll talk a little bit about the a summary um and a little bit about our strategy going into this round of Engagement we'll go over what we heard from the community and talk about the next steps um with the bicycle master plan so I just want to spend a minute to talk about the strategy just to set the stage a little bit for what we're expecting to hear at this point in the plan so with a plan like this we really

are built on community input this is built with the community what the community wants us to be doing that's really what drives a lot of this planning and so when we started the BMP last year the type of input we were trying to get was really from everybody we wanted it to be very low barrier that you didn't have to have a lot of expertise in urban planning or in engineering or in bicycling to be able to give us input into what you want your community to look like so we wanted it to be easy we wanted it to be simple um and you know walk up to a booth and tell us what you think take a survey that you could probably take while your kids are yelling at you in the other room and you're trying to put dinner together um so we got as much of a broad input at the beginning as we could and then layering in all of the data the technical analysis we come up with a draft plan and so this next phase that we just finished of Engagement is really more like we're taking our homework assignment to get checked we really want people to review it and make sure did we get this right did we create a plan that reflects what the community told us the values the expectations of what we heard in the first round so at this point we do expect kind of smaller number of Engagement but a kind of deeper engagement if that makes sense because to give input on this you have to sit down and you have to read quite a bit you have to go through our policies our actions go through the map kind of with a fine tooth

comb and so we got a lot of Engagement um if you look at the numbers of Engagement it looks a little bit different from the beginning but that's really what we would expect at this point and the type of Engagement we got from our community actually even surprised our consultant he told us he was very surprised as we were trying to go through the amount of very in-depth responses and comments we got from our community um so then we take all of that we put it into the plan we refine the plan to make sure that we've kind of heard from the community on that second round then come forward for leadership approval and a final document so tactics to get the word out and get some feedback we had a subscribe list of people that were very interested in this from the beginning so we emailed out to them let them know that the uh story map was available we hosted two virtual public open houses we had technical review committee meetings with the groups that um we had met with before interested groups that had kind of some specialty input to give us um we advertised and inside Bellingham and press release and then those also get published on social media so talking a little bit about what we've heard um first of all where did we hear it from um we heard a lot of comments on engage Bellingham a lot of comments in the open house um we got a lot of comments from our story map and then the rest were kind of from some of those specialty groups so Walk and Roll board gave us a lot of very very

in-depth feedback we heard from neighborhood associations and we heard quite a bit from wash do uh I will say there are kind of two types of feedback that we heard during this process there was a survey that was part of the story map where people could kind of tell us yeah yes no maybe for how well we're doing and we'll go through those and then there are several places where we just accepting people's comments so let's go through those survey responses really quickly so the first one the recommended bicycle Network and projects will help achieve the four goals around safety Equity connectivity and increasing ridership so you can see here 76% of people either agree or strongly agree the draft update goals are what the city should be focused on to improve bicycling for people of all ages and abilities and here you can see 80% of people either agree or strongly agree with that statement the draft policies are what the city should be focused on to achieve planned goals 88% of people either agree or strongly agree and the updated proposed program actions will support the bicycling culture and increase the number of people bicycling and using micromobility in Bellingham uh and here you see 88% of people either agree or strongly agree um so then talking about the comments we saw a couple of themes um of like the types of comments that we were getting a lot of people commented on the bike Network um places that they thought were overlooked places that we missed um which is what we

really would expect we weren't looking for a whole lot of new locations but if you're going to go and you're going to get feedback on something you're probably going to comment about the intersection that's nearest to you the road that's going down your street um so we saw a lot about the network itself a lot of locations specific um and then we heard a lot about protected bike lanes and safety and we'll get a little bit more into that just to give you a map of sort of where the missing connections were that people were highlighting um showing some of the locations on the map that people kept kept pointing out to us we heard a lot about um Happy Valley and safe routes to school um we heard a lot about Connections at samish way at galberth which we are in the process of installing that crosswalk as we speak so that one is a good check off the list um UST Street came up quite a bit um and then Lakeway and just other missing connections were kind of really common comments that we got in those location specific suggestions the by far the biggest comment that we heard was to add protection we wanted people want buffer protected bike Lanes to make make it feel like you're not really in traffic to feel that there is a physical barrier between Riders and traffic um kind of similarly you see add or widen bike path again really wanting that separation from traffic you can see several others here um bik and pedestrian only WID side sidewalks ad M to mold paths Etc so regarding the

policies the policies that we heard uh feedback on nonprotected bike Lanes do not feel safe we heard that over and over again that people really want to have those protected bike Lanes wherever possible um Road speeds need to be slower we heard that one quite a bit um we heard a lot about a needing a policy about cleaning bike Lanes uh everybody thinks that it's great if we have these nice protected bike Lanes but if they're full of debris and leaves and sticks that it's not really a very useful bike lane um and that we need more enforcement traffic enforcement things like that Community engagement so one of the interesting things about really any big long planning process is that timelines sometimes get scooched back a little bit and we ended up falling right over the holidays with our engagement just by BAS based on when the plan happened to be ready to go out to the community and so the top two were comments that we heard at the beginning quite a bit that people thought the comment period was too short and that it shouldn't be over the holidays especially when Western students weren't in session we were able to address that and we extended the comment section by uh a couple of weeks to help accommodate that and we actually got a lot of comments in those last couple of weeks so it's a good thing that we did that um and then the other thing we heard a lot was we need more driver and biker education so our next steps as I said we're going to integrate those comments into the

plan we're going to finalize the plan recommendations um we will send that to the Transportation Commission for review in March we'll go through that with them in April and then final city council hearing and action will be in May I will happily stand for any questions thank you very much Council list um Natalie thank you very much for that um I'm really glad to hear that um that you've received the message uh about protected bike Lanes I I've tried to be upbeat about it over the last 10 years and and not bad mouth paint but paint has never been enough but the reason why we used paint at first for bike Lanes it's it's a lot cheaper and faster um if indeed we adopt a higher and stronger commitment to protected bike Lanes how do we overcome the extra time effort space cost how is how is that if we're going to promise to do more protection on bike Lanes how are we going to do that what will that look like in terms of implementation and costs and and things like that and I can't answer that question I'll kick it over to these guys but I will say what we have been telling the community is that there is always going to be a balance between those things between there are going to be places where we could do a very very beautiful expensive maybe like completely isolated bike lane but that would mean that that would take away from several other projects as well and so we do have to make sure that we're balancing those things and it is hard and I'll kick it to Joel for how we actually

make those decisions because that would be him yeah I think what we're going to be looking at in uh in this plan is um really uh starting from the perspective of you know with most projects the idea of can we make a separated bike lane work here I think in the past that is not always been the case um actually the state department of Transportation um has taken this approach now with um implementing new intersections and roundabouts basically they have a default that they start at roundabout and then you need to justify why a roundabout won't work and so I think that that's what we've talked about with um protected bike Lanes is you know it is it is a system we're trying to create um it is a a wrestling of kind of cost benefit we could build really great protected cycle tracks just like we have on the waterfront with all our money but we would maybe be disappointed with how much Network we have um over a over a decade but it's really trying to balance that and look at uh the context of each individual project how important is that separation that comes down to things like the the speed of the ad adjacent traffic the um the cost of implementing that um that uh protected bike lane the volume of traffic and so going forward we probably won't be doing separated bike Lanes everywhere but anywhere that it's feasible and possible that's what we'll be doing so I'd like to offer my opinion and guidance on this matter we made a lot of progress using paint I'll call it um it may be time

to stop doing that and settle for the fact that we mayed to do fewer but better projects I base that based on going back 10 years the original public feedback um and guidance is that we had a lot of writers who were interested in writing but frankly it was the safety concern that kept them away they were interested but they weren't as bold as someone who will just take the lane we knew that back then and now we heard it again I think the same feedback but now this time focused because now the public doesn't just say hey I don't feel safe now they're knowing why and when they feel feel safe and protection makes them feel safe I think we might be better off doing fewer better projects and rather than spreading it around we did a lot of spreading we've got a pretty decent Network you know with unprotected bike Lanes now might be time I think my guidance my opinion is to readjust that and decide we're going to do fewer but better projects and so we we will so where we have a completed project it will be the gold standard and it will be used um I think you know there's something called induced demand in transportation you know about all the time you don't know how much traffic is there until you build a new roadway or build a new facility and all of a sudden the riders that you never saw or the drivers you never saw come out of the woodwork I think we're going to see a lot of induced demand when we build truly protected bike Lanes so in terms of the the The Balancing Act I agree

that is that is the right message I'm just saying personally I think we I think we should start tilting much further towards fewer and better thank you Anderson just to kind of tie into that thought process because I was having much of the same um ideas what would be useful if we are to go forward with fewer but more intentional is really looking at those areas of opportunity where the lanes are the least safe but we have a lot of bike traffic for commuting um if I want to go from my house to walk in Community College I know there are certain neighborhoods I can go through where speed is slower um and I would feel safer commuting that way but there are certain pinch points those aren't options and so then you're into a roadway that you are having to share Lanes in order to get as a commuter um so I think of things like Holly going from Lakeway downtown um you're a little bit more limited on some of the residential areas but I'd like to know a little bit more in the future about the most bang for the buck of being able to put in that protected Lane in order to help create that comfort for people to get into some of the the more um congested locations because I know I wouldn't ride a bike from my house to downtown there's not a route that I've identified that I'm not in traffic and I would feel safe and crosswalk I mean sidewalks are not an option so um there's some areas that as a bike rider I don't feel safe so I'm assuming I'm not the only one that that is one other concept

that um and it's something the city has thought about for a long time with our kind of complete Network strategy but um you know along with some of the research that generated the kind of rubric around all the interested but concerned cyclist is this idea that um you could have 90% of a trip feel um feel separated and safe and if 10% is like high stress um it's like 0% of the trip is um is a it's a trip that somebody's just going to grab their car keys or they're going to find some other way to go go about it so that's another thing that we're always trying to balance is trying to create complete Networks so that you know that one barrier that you know getting AC getting through Sunset Square you know will is a you maybe is the limit that has somebody has so that is something else that we're thinking about and and to to build on what Joel's here to say that that that there's other things besides that where do you put your bike when you get to the end of that trip right if you're interested but concerned and the street is completely safe you feel safe going down a protected bike line but you're concerned about your bike getting stolen that's a barrier to you taking that trip as well so so these are these are great things that we need to vet through the public policy perspective and they're I think they'll be reflected in the development of The Pedestrian and the bicycle master plan the Transportation Commission has been asking many of those same questions and so we're excited

to bring that forward reflecting that feedback that we're hearing from the community from the Transportation Commission that use the council as well uh the the the challenge of course is trying to balance what we can do and how we and when we do those things which brings the implementation side of it into the conversation which is done through the six-year tip right so as we bring for things forward on the sixe tip for projects in the next 3 four or five years uh the development of these policies which says first look at a protected B Cline and we'll have to make that the recommendations on those projects in that lens of start there right and and and the impacts that will be to those types of more protected facilities that we'd like to see will be more than simply cost that would be reduction in lanes that would be removal of on street parking that will be changes to the roadway geometry which have a greater effect on the implementation of that simply than just the the cost of the and yes paint is cheaper uh but that's not always the best solution right we're we're recognizing that as the community in this Arc of progression of bicycle infrastructure uh what took you know Copenhagen 35 40 years to come up with is taking us 10 to 15 years so our our acceleration curve and developing that infrastructure that we want to see is much faster than some other places and we're in that natural progression we're getting there uh Joel used the the reference to the the do that starts with

roundabouts first right and and if you can't do that you do something different we're doing flip doing the same thing with protected bicycle infrastructure that's the starting point and then everything else comes after that right it we we could put a protected bike lane in but that means removing you know two lanes of traffic well what if there's only two lanes available that doesn't quite fit in the mix so we need to think through those things but I just want to communicate that that we're on the right track we're recommending recognizing what the community is asking us to do there are more implications of those than simply cost uh and and and all those things will be coming through uh but I'm excited to see that recommendation coming out of this next duration of the plan uh and hopeing to bring that back to Council in April and May time frame for your approval counc member liist the other thing I want to talk about had to do with um it's related to the concern that people have for bike Lanes being cleaned uh couple years ago five um there there's the bike lane that that comes the one I take from Fair Haven North right and goes to the war Street roundabout and goes up onto North Forest Street and at that point we did the clever thing which is what I want to talk about is switching the parking and bike lanes that from a uh a really good physical protected bike lane and one of the best buffers you can have is a line of heavy metal cars right where people Park and then you're

on the outside now you're riding next to either parked cars and only parked cars rather than between parked and driving cars or and parked cars and the and the uh pedestrians the sidewalk it's really a great idea flipping the lanes putting the bike Lanes where they ought to be away from traffic in their own bike lane problem in that case is that the street cleaner that used to go and be able to clean that we had signs that said don't park here after 2: am on Thursday night but people were parking there after 2 am.

on Thursday night and initially I think staff came forward and recommended UNF flipping them just so they could be cleaned and I think the feedback the council gave is no why are we punishing the bicycles for a good idea we should just get people to actually move their cars so we can do the cleaning I don't know if that's the best solution solution or not I think we have a little mini Zamboni street cleaner thing what is the solution going to be on cleaning the bike lanes and will that solution make it easier for us to flip the bike lane and in more locations throughout the town maybe take that one step further and reference this last winter storm we had in January so we did the protected bike lane on Cordata right so well we knew it was going to be for various reasons we had to get the gutter lines clear of snow for during that snow event but since we couldn't run the the snow plow down that protected bike lanane that meant we had staff by hand with a snowblower walking that several miles to clear out the gutter line so when the snow started to melt it wasn't going to flood the entire roadway so the point is that that these types of protected infrastructure when they're adapted to existing roadways and not done separately like we did on granery and Laurel with the brand new roadway section it requires an increased amount of Maintenance it requires an increased amount of enforcement to existing regulations so do we get to the point where we are willing to accept that we're

going to be Towing Vehicles so we can sweep that street that's that's that that's the Arc of where it gets to but the common theme there is increased level of Maintenance increased level of Staff involvement in the activities that need to occur and the Investments and the funding that comes from the council to support that through the street and transportation division to make those things happen so there's different equipment we need to buy we'll make the Investments to buy that different equipment we'll need to invest in additional Staffing to make sure that we can get those things done uh but adapting existing roadways that was developed based on 1930s 40s 50s models of Transportation car Centric F Focus adapting that to to a different model means you have to deal with the situation that comes up and that's really a sense of increased dollars increased personnel and the impacts that come from that which might meaning your car gets towed at Thursday at 2 o'clock in the morning does Copenhagen plow snow plow it's always sunny it's always sunny in Copenhagen no but you seriously Copenhagen is a gold standard right I presumably there's some really cool Danish made snowplow just for bike Lanes or something I mean there are are there solutions that we could adapt like the little street cleaner we use in Alleyways and sidewalks are are is there is there seems to me that we I'd like us to go there is there is there are is there equipment we can use there is and I think that one of

the recommendations of the plan says that the the policy adoption says that we invest in those different types of equipment and those higher labor intensive resources to maintain that type of it's just that as I that Arc of development of our bicycle infrastructure we're on that same Arc and those other communities the the world renowned communities of the world Copenhagen um have adopted adapted to that and that means increased levels of equipment maintenance time and resources to take care of those more intense facilities so it's we're on from my perspective in this world we're on that same Arc we're just at a faster rate of development of that than other places who who did it before we did so I guess briefly just to follow up on that and then I'll turn president Hamill um wondering I know that when President List initially spoke to sort of the prioritization and part of it was thinking about new right new routes that are being identified and sort of what's the standard going to be for that but what I see is the right broad Network that we currently have and obviously the deficiencies and what we're talking about right are all those obstacles especially when you're looking at existing infrastructure that's already there and you're trying to sort of piece this in um but I think at some point yeah that's a question about you know what's the priority laying new routes or addressing the routes that we currently have and ensuring that those are done done well um so support for

the comments shared by my fellow council members council member Hamill um thank you chair I'll keep my uh remarks brief we're getting upper time here but um I know we're talking about connectivity and about kind of getting from point A to point B and the very important discussion I agree with the council member Lilo Quist um assessment that we need to have better that we should be investing in higher levels of like separation from vehicle uh car vehicles and um motor vehicles and and bikes the one thing that I didn't really see in here is um uh trying to encourage people to to reduce their car trips to downtown and we see this um see a lot of new ebikes out there that's kind of been a a big Trend and um I'm just wondering how we can uh help ensure uh riders that when they get downtown and they go to a restaurant or go shopping or go go to a bar whatever they're they're doing that their bike's going to be there when they get back and we've talked before um over the years of you know trying to do like bike lockers things like that and I just have not seen any forbo progress on that and I mean the impacts are for you know climate reduct or climate impacts um for health of people that are riding their their bikes uh for economic uh development for downtown so what's what how are we addressing those issues your question is quite timely actually so uh you might recall with the 23 24 budget council member Stone made an amendment to do a pilot for bicycle storage uh and put some

money in the budget to do that and we'd hope to get that in in early 2023 but they taking a little bit more time uh but we're hoping to come to Council in early May time frame we're T of on the date but uh that will re ire a council resolution I believe for to set the fees on how to use those bicycle lockers and and there's delays as always good government projects are always delayed but the the uh we're also coordinating with the port and WTA and Western who are also interested in the same question and how do we find a solution that's common to all of our responsibilities that lets that bicycle Rider feel secure that when they get to the destination their bike's going to be there when they're ready to go home so we're hopeful to come back in early May time frame and line that up with the installation of those of those lockers along with a resolution the council will need to set the fees on the use of those lockers like we have with other fees structures uh but we are moving see with that progress and and I think in the and Joel can speak to this about the the plan itself identifying that safe bike storage at the end of your destination as a key element and one of the things for implementation to bring forward and I'll just um add on a little bit that um you know this was focused on the the community feedback and and I would like to think that maybe one of the reasons that wasn't said so much in this round of community feedback is it was something that was shown in what we

put out to the community a lot of information about we want to do we want to improve bike parking we wanted um up our standards and and it was a it is a priority for making that complete trip and so um that is something that is I think the community will be pleased to see that that is a focus that in the plan and is going to be reflected in the final plan that you see that's a great point that there are several things that the community to did tell us and did make it into the plan that didn't rise to the top in this level of Engagement partially because they were presumably well addressed in the draft plan so there are several other themes that are being addressed in the bike master plan that are not being presented on today for this engagement summary so in followup to that I guess in closing for this presentation the story map that was developed is that still available and can the community still right see that online and where's that um it's on engage Bellingham um and it is still available the survey is disabled but all of the information about the draft plan is still available there the network and the policies and things like that I just recall even with the um transportation fund and other pieces the story Maps I feel like do a great job of I'm just sort of touching on every aspect of a project and plan that's so um large as this and so the work that goes into creating that hopefully it's seen as a resource for the community as well um and in that mapping I guess one

of my questions is whether or not we have um identified maps that identify which routes are protected at this point in time and not or if that's something that we could look at doing when um when the community is looking at potential routes around town uh yeah the um the the maps that are on um on there now are focused on like a on Street facility so I think one thing will be refining there are project lists on there too that more specific about what we're envisioning for specific corridors but that's the you know draft that this response was to and so we're going to continue to be refining that and be more clear about which facilities are reflected in the plan as being a more of a typical bike lane or a separated bike lane but also being more clear upfront that what we're going to try to start with everywhere is can we fit a separated bik Lan in this this particular context thank you very much for the presentation and for your team's work on um yeah on this ongoing work and an engagement piece and so we were saying that this would likely come back to council we're looking at around May is that the estimate so okay thank you very much thank you with that that's end of committee and I'll turn it back to you president Hamill thank you chair um the next committee would be Parks and Recreation that's going to start at 1:45 uh and that'll be chaired by uh council member skip Williams we'll start just in a few minutes it's 1:38 right now so we've got about 7 minutes